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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
732
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Posted - 2011.10.28 00:43:00 -
[1] - Quote
Baphommet wrote:I made a reply on another thread, and I though the subject required more attention. So instead of coming up with ideas on highsec careers like in the other thread, I'd like to have your opinion on weather my points are valid and reasonable.
Here was my post:
(The idea is that lvl 4s are way OP)
------------
Has it ever occurred to anybody that some people only play BECAUSE of level 4's?
And anyway, why is it neccessary to move carebears to get PvP? Is it because they will make low/0.0 target rich?
PvP'ers are the ones complaining about lowsec etc. so why don't YOU move out there?
I've already said - and this is why I post on it, if highsec targets are taken away (either by assured safety OR by complete reversal of highsec safety), then people will move out by default.
PvP'ers DON'T want to leave highsec because they are SAFE there. It's not a "carebear" created problem.
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest.
WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
733
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Posted - 2011.10.28 00:55:00 -
[2] - Quote
Baphommet wrote:The Apostle wrote:Baphommet wrote:I made a reply on another thread, and I though the subject required more attention. So instead of coming up with ideas on highsec careers like in the other thread, I'd like to have your opinion on weather my points are valid and reasonable.
Here was my post:
(The idea is that lvl 4s are way OP)
------------ Has it ever occurred to anybody that some people only play BECAUSE of level 4's? And anyway, why is it neccessary to move carebears to get PvP? Is it because they will make low/0.0 target rich? PvP'ers are the ones complaining about lowsec etc. so why don't YOU move out there? I've already said - and this is why I post on it, if highsec targets are taken away (either by assured safety OR by complete reversal of highsec safety), then people will move out by default. PvP'ers DON'T want to leave highsec because they are SAFE there. It's not a "carebear" created problem. My general feeling is that this game would be more interesting if there was either some sort of conflict, or a good deal of organization need to get to the best income. So you CAN stay in highsec to make isk, but just running boring, old, soloable, easy missions won't get you nearly as much income as fighting for resources or building a great prodoction chain with ten other people from the ground up. Get my drift? Carebears can still have income, just not as much as people willing to fight for the bounties of dangerous space. PS- If level 4s are the only reason to play EVE of a person, then I'll be baffled. Missions are by design boring.
Yeah. I'm not refuting the logic but lowsec/0.0 is underpopulated because of several reasons OTHER than the quantity/quality of missions.
The type of person that does missions all day (rightly or wrongly) is also not the type of person to head to lowsec/0.0 to make their coin.
You must keep in mind that 0.0 and L5's in lowsec are much more profitable than L4's, so using your logic, why haven't they moved? It's not the isk, it's the safety.
Same reason why PvP'ers stay in highsec. Mitigation of risk.
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest.
WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
733
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Posted - 2011.10.28 01:00:00 -
[3] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:The Apostle wrote:Baphommet wrote:I made a reply on another thread, and I though the subject required more attention. So instead of coming up with ideas on highsec careers like in the other thread, I'd like to have your opinion on weather my points are valid and reasonable.
Here was my post:
(The idea is that lvl 4s are way OP)
------------ Has it ever occurred to anybody that some people only play BECAUSE of level 4's? And anyway, why is it neccessary to move carebears to get PvP? Is it because they will make low/0.0 target rich? PvP'ers are the ones complaining about lowsec etc. so why don't YOU move out there? I've already said - and this is why I post on it, if highsec targets are taken away (either by assured safety OR by complete reversal of highsec safety), then people will move out by default. PvP'ers DON'T want to leave highsec because they are SAFE there. It's not a "carebear" created problem. why do YOU play? Other than to QQ out of curiosity...
To be perfectly honest, atm I have no idea. I've done it all and part of my problem I think is I have too much isk and doing anything just doesn't hold any appeal.
I WANT to go to back to 0.0 but I have no interest in the politics, the BS and the lack of incentive working for someone else. I also have no opportunity to get started - so I am "stuck".
PS: I can do QQ with a plex a month for the next 20 years without ever logging 
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest.
WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
733
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Posted - 2011.10.28 01:04:00 -
[4] - Quote
Baphommet wrote:The Apostle > You must keep in mind that 0.0 and L5's in lowsec are much more profitable than L4's
Level 5s maybe, but 0.0?
I'm still feeling that 4s are way overpowered. Overpowered enough to make dangerous ventures not worth it. Fives may reward more, I don't really have much to say on that.
Belt ratting alone in 0.0, if chained right can pull coin better than L4's. Throw in a Commander ocassionally and bang, instant billionaire.
Sanctums etc. are 40+/hr. if you can score a 10/10 you can often pull 2b+ on a drop. A single Vindi BPC well net 700m for an hours work.
0.0 cash is much,much easier cash - but the price you pay for the politics and the campers is just too high some days.
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest.
WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
733
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Posted - 2011.10.28 01:40:00 -
[5] - Quote
Embrace My Hate wrote:I think we got off topic. The argument isn't trying to move people to 0.0 or lowsec. The biggest problem with level 4 missions is that they don't encourage multiplayer interaction in a game driven by multiplayer interaction. I have no problem with there being very lucrative things in highsec and I do not expect people to be forced to move into less safe space. I happen to agree with the OP when he states that the most lucrative things in high sec should take at the very least a minimal amount of teamwork and coordination beyond what currently exists.
As for 0.0 ratting/plexing whatever. I works just like EFT, on paper it sounds wonderful and there's shiny pots of gold everywhere. Realistically for the average null-sec player it is far more difficult. Most systems are **** and the ones that aren't **** are already in heavy use by other players. You can still make a lot of ISK in null no doubt but its not always the ISK printing machine some people make it out to be.
You're absolutely right and it comes back the same ol'. Did the significant shift to highsec occur after the Sanctums nerfs?
The high population in the "good" systems (as you said) took away the isk potential so much so that moving to highsec gave you similar income without the risk - particularly Incursions.
Although, granted, Incursions require solid fleet discipline and multiplayer ethos but the coinage is superb for relatively low risk.
I'm pretty sure CCP have the numbers and the Sanctum nerf may well be reversed if what we're saying has any truth in it.
For mine, L4 missions ain't the problem, they're the result.
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest.
WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
735
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Posted - 2011.10.28 02:03:00 -
[6] - Quote
Embrace My Hate wrote:The Apostle wrote:
You're absolutely right and it comes back the same ol'. Did the significant shift to highsec occur after the Sanctums nerfs?
The high population in the "good" systems (as you said) took away the isk potential so much so that moving to highsec gave you similar income without the risk - particularly Incursions.
Although, granted, Incursions require solid fleet discipline and multiplayer ethos but the coinage is superb for relatively low risk.
I'm pretty sure CCP have the numbers and the Sanctum nerf may well be reversed if what we're saying has any truth in it.
For mine, L4 missions ain't the problem, they're the result.
I think the point I'm trying to make is that in order to do anything in 0.0 lot's of things have to happen. There needs to be sov/upgrades. Some stuff needs to be scanned, most are to difficult to do without multiple players. You need to be aware of hostile players etc, etc. As for level 4 missions there is very little to no interaction. Even disregarding how much ISK you actually make doing it it is just a very poor mechanic that fosters a very un-eve like mentality. Missions are sort of the theme park in a sandbox world they just don't really fit. Am I making any sense lol?
Yes, yes you do. I did L4's for quite a time using 3 of my own chars in my own corp. 1 tengu, a claymore and a noctis. made millions. No effort, no need to put any social aspect into what I did.
It does fly in the face of a "multiplayer" environment but having said that, solo ratters in 0.0 do that all day also. The "co-operative bit" only applies in case on home defense/CTA's....
Someone did suggest making L4's "sleeper" style making co-operation more neccessary but then the rewards need to escalate to be commensurate - otherwise may as just go shoot WH rats all day.
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest.
WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
735
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Posted - 2011.10.28 02:21:00 -
[7] - Quote
Nova Fox wrote:LVL 4s would be profitable for me if i wasnt losing a ship every two weeks in one.
Do you use eve-agents.com?
L4's only kill ships if you pull triggers before cleaning up.
Also, primary is scrambling frigs - always.
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest.
WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
750
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Posted - 2011.10.28 05:01:00 -
[8] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:
quote=Aqriue]Eve in a nutshell
- terrible FPS in space.
um its not a First Person Shooter[/quote]
That's why it's a terrible FPS 
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest.
WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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